“my mother would say over and over again, “Work hard.”
And sometime working in the field, I would say to my mother, “This is hard work, and this work is about to kill me.” And she would say, “Boy, hard work never killed anybody.” So I worked very, very hard as a child.”
“I discovered, I guess, that you have to have this sense of faith that what you’re moving toward is already done. It’s already happened.
Ms. Tippett: Say some more about that.
Rep. Lewis: It’s the power to believe that you can see, that you can visualize, that sense of community, that sense of family, that sense of one house.”
“Ms. Tippett: And live as if?
Rep. Lewis: And you live that you’re already there, that you’re already in that community, part of that sense of one family, one house. If you visualize it, if you can even have faith that it’s there, for you, it is already there.”
“Ms. Tippett: You had made that vision real.
Rep. Lewis: For the struggle, for those of us in the struggle. But we studied. We prepared ourselves.”
“Rep. Lewis: We did go through the motion, the drama, of saying that if someone kick you, spit on you, pull you off the lunch counter stool, continue to make eye contact. Continue to give the impression, “Yes, you may beat me, but I’m human.””
“Rep. Lewis: You’re so right. First of all, you have to grow. It’s just not something that is natural. You have to be taught the way of peace, the way of love, the way of nonviolence. And in the religious sense, in the moral sense, you can say in the bosom of every human being, there is a spark of the divine. So you don’t have a right as a human to abuse that spark of the divine in your fellow human being.”
“We, from time to time, would discuss if you see someone attacking you, beating you, spitting on you, you have to think of that person — years ago, that person was an innocent child, innocent little baby. And so what happened? Something go wrong? Did the environment? Did someone teach that person to hate, to abuse others? So you try to appeal to the goodness of every human being. And you don’t give up. You never give up on anyone.”
“Ms. Tippett: So here’s a line from your book Across That Bridge: “The Civil Rights Movement, above all, was a work of love. Yet even 50 years later, it is rare to find anyone who would use the word ‘love’ to describe what we did.” What you just said to me illuminates that. I think part of the explanation of that is the way you are using the word “love” is very rich and multilayered and also challenging, challenging for the person who loves.”
“Rep. Lewis: Well, I think in our culture, I think sometimes people are afraid to say “I love you.” But we’re afraid to say, especially in public life, many elected officials or worldly elected officials, are afraid to talk about love. Maybe people tend to think something is so emotional about it. Maybe it’s a sign of weakness. And we’re not supposed to cry. We’re supposed to be strong. But love is strong. Love is powerful.”
“The movement created what I like to call a nonviolent revolution. It was love at its best. It’s one of the highest forms of love. That you beat me, you arrest me, you take me to jail, you almost kill me, but in spite of that, I’m going to still love you. I know Dr. King used to joke sometimes and say things like, “Just love the hell outta everybody. Just love ‘em.””
“You often refer to one of Gandhi’s important terms, satyagraha.”
“You also wrote, “Suffering can be nothing more than a sad and sorry thing without the presence on the part of the sufferer of a graceful heart, an accepting, an open heart, a heart that holds no malice toward the inflictors of his or her suffering.” I mean, I guess that brings us back to this idea of love.”
“But whatever you do, whatever your response is, is with love, kindness, and that sense of faith. In my religious tradition is this belief that it’s going to work out. It is going to work out. It’s all going to be all right. And people will ask me from time to time, “What shall we do, John, during the sit-ins or during the freedom rides?” And I would say, “We need to find a way to dramatize the issue. We need to find a way to get in the way, but it should be in a peaceful, loving, nonviolent fashion.” Hate is too heavy a burden to bear.”
“It says something about the power of love, the power of nonviolence that it happened to move us toward a reconciliation.”
“Ms. Tippett: And I keep wanting — I want to push you a little bit because the word “love,” as you said, it’s romantic. Love, as you are talking about it, as you have aspired to live it, is not a way you feel. It’s a way of being, right?”
“Rep. Lewis: It’s a way of being, yes. It’s a way of action. It’s not necessarily passive. It has the capacity, it has the ability to bring peace out of conflict. It has the capacity to stir up things in order to make things right. When we were sitting in, it was love in action.”
“Rep. Lewis: Right. When we went on the freedom ride, it was love in action. The march from Selma to Montgomery was love in action. We do it not simply because it’s the right thing to do, but it’s love in action. That we love a country, we love a democratic society, and so we have to move our feet.”
“Ms. Tippett: That phrase, an African proverb, “When you pray, move your feet,” you’ve got that in both of your books. I even tweeted it the other day. People love it. It’s an amazing phrase. It’s also interesting how that imagery recurs. You talk about Montgomery and speaking with their feet. Heschel, after the march, said he felt like he was praying, his feet were praying.”
“American politics as an extension of my faith, not simply as an extension of my involvement in the Civil Rights Movement. My life, whether in the Civil Rights Movement or whether in American politics, is an extension of my faith.”
“But if you’re going to do it, do it full and with love, peace, nonviolence, and that element of faith.””
“And in the end, I knew within my own soul that it was going to be a long haul, and I believe that. You don’t change the world, the society, in a few days. And it’s better. It is better to be a pilot light than to be a firecracker.”
“Rep. Lewis: You have to believe, and you can never, ever, give up on any possibility. It’s part of it, as I said, from the beginning. It’s already done. You just have to find a way to make it real.”